Jonathon Henry Wheatley BURNS

[vivjay67]

Hi, I'm really hoping someone can help as I feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall!!

I'm trying to find the birth or baptism of Jonathon Henry Wheatley Burns in Doncaster. According to his marriage certificate he would have been born 1857. I don't know where abouts in Doncaster although there is a place called Wheatley so I'm wondering if it could be there.


I've tried looking for him under various names as his family have changed their name several times so I'm confused as to what name to look for.

When he got married he was Jonathon Henry Wheatley Burns. On his son's birth certificate he has the same name, however by the 1891 census he has become John Henry Wheatley and the family dropped the Burns. They are still Wheatley's to this day!!

Can anyone help me find him please as I can't further my research until I find him and his parents - according to his marriage certificate his father is called George if that helps!!

Many Thanks in advance

Viv

[Sylcec]

Viv - Is John Henry Wheatley with wife Mary in Abergavenny, Monmouthshire, in 1901, the right person? I note that his occupation is tailor. Children: Archibald 15, Florence 9, Barbara 7, Gertrude 4.

As you have no doubt found, there are men named John Henry Wheatley who show up in the various censuses. As you have the marriage certificate for the right person, could you post the details from that marriage certificate, which should include his father's name?

[vivjay67]

Hi, Yes it is the right family. Remember I mentioned all the name changes - Archibald Wheatley married as Charles Archibald Wheatley!! No idea where the Charles came from but he certainly wasn't born with it as I have his birth certificate.

Details from marriage certificate

Aug 9th 1880 in the parish of North Wingfield Derby

Jonathon Henry Wheatley BURNS age 23. Bachelor. Tailor. Living North Wingfield. Father - George Burns. Tailor

Mary Whetton, age 17. Spinster. Living North Wingfield. Father James Whetton. Stoker.

Even though I have this info about his father I can't find a family of Burns on the 1861 or 1871 census with a father George and a son Jonathon Henry or even just John Henry.

I've taken every line of my family tree back so far that it's very frustrating to only be able to get back to the 1850's on this line. It took 10 years to find Archibalds birth because I was looking for Charles Archibald Wheatley and as he wasn't born as that there was obviously no birth record for that, but we didn't know that at the time!!

Any help you can give is very greatly appreciated!!

Regards

Viv

[Sylcec]

Viv
I suppose that you have checked and excluded on the 1861 census Jonathan H Burn born abt 1857 Sunderland, Durham, living at South Bishop Wearmouth with his mother:
Margaret G BURN, married, age 34, Seaman's wife MM
John C Burn, son, age 14, ships carpenter
Sarah E Burn, dau, age 10, scholar
Johanathan H Burn, son, age 4
Margaret G Burn, dau, age 2

Where the father's occupation is given on Jonathon Henry's marriage certificate as 'Tailor' - could it possibly have been misread for 'Sailor'?
By the way, I think the fellow found above was in an Industrial School in 1871.

The only Jonathan found so far, born Doncaster is Jonathan GILVRAY (indexed as Giloray)
There are several John Henrys born Doncaster, but again none seem to fit. In general I had more luck searching for JonathAn rather than JonathOn and I was essentially searching only on Christian name, age and place of birth, adding in father's name for good measure in 1861.

Reasons for the surname confusion could include the following:
Jonathan Henry was illegitimate, with birth registered as, say, Wheatley, which was his mother's name
His mother subsequently marries ?George Burn(s) and Jonathan adopts his surname to add to the one he began with.
Otherwise - frankly, I'm stumped!
Sylvia

[vivjay67]

Hi Sylvia

I hadn't looked at the Durham one as I was looking in and around Doncaster. I've got the marriage certificate in front of me and his father is definetely Tailor nor Sailor. It's a capital T and underneath his father in laws occupation is Stoker so it's easy to compare the T and S. Jonathon was also a Tailor so I think it's correct.

To check one way or the other I looked for him on later census' to see if his father appears so I can check his name. On the 1871 he is a scholar in a boarding school and I can't find him on the 1881 at all.

I've had another look at the marriage certificate and his name is spelt with an A not an O so it's Jonathan.

I've also looked for a Jonathan Wheatley, ,a Jonathon Wheatley, a Jonathon Burn(s) and a Jonathan Burn (s) around 1855-1860 in the Doncaster area but drawn a blank. I've looked for a marriage of a female Wheatley to a George Burns and can't find one of those either to try and clear it up that way. I can't find any family on the 1861 or 1871 census' who fit what I know.

I suppose I'll eventually find him!! It took 10 years to find his son's birth certificate due the the 2 name changes he had between being born and getting married so I guess if I wait long enough something will come up.

Thanks for your help looking.

Viv

[callbrian]

Hi Viv,
This may sound silly or you may have already tried this. Have you put in just 'Wheatley' as a first name then Burns in surname. There are quite a few listings in Ancestry with a Jon, Jno or John when trying this search.
Brian

[vivjay67]

Hi Brian
I hadn't thought of this as I was assuming that Wheatley was a surname or middle name. On the birth certificate of his son it gets a bit more confusing

The son is born as
Archibald (1st name) Wheatley (middle name) Burns (surname)

His father (the person I'm looking for now) is described as
John (1st name) Henry (middle name) Wheatley (another middle name) Burns (surname)

The mother is described as

Mary (1st name) Wheatley (a middle name) Burns (surname) formerly Whetton (maiden name)

The thing is Mary Whetton never had a middle name so Wheatley must have come from the husband but why would it be described as a middle name on her son's birth certificate? Her signature is showing as M W Burns but if Wheatley and Burns had become a double surname she would have shown as M Wheatley-Burns.

I've had a look on Ancestry and when I type in Wheatley as a first name and Burns as a surname I come across 2 people who show the Wheatley. One is their son Archibald and the other is an Annie Wheatley Burns born 2 years after their son. I don't think she is anything to do with the family unless she is a sibling to Archibald and died very young. Seems a bit of a coincidence that she has a middle name of Wheatley as well. By the time Archibalds sister was born in 1891 they had dropped the Burns and going forward they were just Wheatley's and there is no mention of any Annie on the 1891 census entry so maybe she is nothing to do with them.

I'm getting very confused with these people!

Thanks for your suggestion

Viv

[ksouthall]

I've had a look on Ancestry and when I type in Wheatley as a first name and Burns as a surname I come across 2 people who show the Wheatley. One is their son Archibald and the other is an Annie Wheatley Burns born 2 years after their son. I don't think she is anything to do with the family unless she is a sibling to Archibald and died very young. Seems a bit of a coincidence that she has a middle name of Wheatley as well. By the time Archibald's sister was born in 1891 they had dropped the Burns and going forward they were just Wheatley's and there is no mention of any Annie on the 1891 census entry so maybe she is nothing to do with them.

Viv

Hello Viv,

I have just had a look on Multimap and it is only 16 miles from Belper to Chesterfield. Archibald's birth was registered in Belper and Annie Wheatley Burn's birth was registered in Chesterfield. As this is quite a short distance, and the family may have had to move around for work, there is a fair chance Annie was the younger sister of Archibald. She may have died in childhood, or been farmed out to relatives in the 1891 Census.

So saying, I have not found a likely candidate for Annie elsewhere on the 1891 Census, nor a marriage or death certificate in the 1837 - 1915 collections, so it is difficult to say what happened to her. It may provide you with additional information if you were to obtain a copy of her birth certificate - even if that were to prove she wasn't Archibald's sister - as it would give you details of other people combining the names Wheatley and Burns. The combination of the two names suggests there is a reasonably high chance they are related to you.

I am not sure how much this helps, however sometimes I have found more information out about my own family by following up unlikely leads than when following up those which look most likely.

Good luck.

[vivjay67]

Sounds like a good plan - I'll wait until the certificate I've ordered has arrived - spending too much on certificates at the moment!!!

I must admit it's unusual to put those 2 names together and I was also unable to find any trace of her after her birth.

I'm beginning to think that Jonathan has never existed and that he was a figment of the families imagination!!!

Regards

Viv